Weighing options for heads

[alone_and_insane]

So as you may know, I've been living out a bit of a nightmare with the engine replacement on my Camaro. I bought a long block from [MENTION=1248]birdie2000[/MENTION], supposedly a low-mile rebuild. Mild Lunati Voodoo cam, ported heads, forged pistons, 1.6rr's. I swapped intake manifolds (because my old one was powdercoated), got it in the car, had it running, found I was running coolant in my oil, pulled the head, found the head and #2 piston were badly damaged from debris (that I have no idea where it came from), so I had to pull the engine and start the project over. Once I had the engine out, I pulled the other head (just to make sure everything was fine), but that one was damaged as well (though not nearly as bad). I took the heads to a shop to get repaired, and they called me later and told me that my valve guides were totally worn out, so on top of the repairs I was gonna need a complete valve job done. I was quoted $850 for everything, which I think is more than the heads are worth. I need some opinions for what direction to go next. My options are:

1. Bite the bullet, just get these heads fixed and move on. ~$850
2. Pick up a set of stock heads. ~$100-$200, but I won't be at the power levels I wanted with that cam on stock heads.
3. Find a set of used aftermarket or ported heads. ~$600-$800 maybe (not really sure how much that kind of stuff goes for), but for all I know I could run into the same kind of thing and need to sink a bunch of money into them before putting them on. Kinda risky
4. Buy a brand new set of aftermarket heads. $1500+, but I would have no doubts that everything's good to go. Way over budget, though, especially considering that's over half of what I paid for the whole engine.

That's sort of what I've come up with so far. Thoughts on any of these, or any options I haven't considered?

[Gearhead4life]

what heads do you have currently ?

[birdie2000]

I still feel bad over this whole thing.

You don't still have your stock heads from the last motor? I'd get a set of stock heads, send them to LE and get an LE1 job. It's like $900 + whatever a set of stock heads is. Not ideal, but you'd have ported heads for not a whole lot more than fixing the current ones, and you'd know they'd be good to go.

http://elliottsportworks.com/home/?page_id=51

[alone_and_insane]

what heads do you have currently ?

I currently have the still-damaged ported stock heads (I'd have to check the casting #) that were on the engine I bought

I still feel bad over this whole thing.

You don't still have your stock heads from the last motor? I'd get a set of stock heads, send them to LE and get an LE1 job. It's like $900 + whatever a set of stock heads is. Not ideal, but you'd have ported heads for not a whole lot more than fixing the current ones, and you'd know they'd be good to go.

http://elliottsportworks.com/home/?page_id=51

I sold the old longblock to [MENTION=709]bri2203[/MENTION] for cheap just to get it off my hands, so I don't have my old heads. I think that engine became a coffee table lol.

Weren't the valves upgrades as well? I thought you said there was something different about them vs stock...but otherwise, that Elliot Motorsports package looks like a pretty good option.

[birdie2000]

No, they were stock valves in those heads as far as I know.

[bri2203]

I currently have the still-damaged ported stock heads (I'd have to check the casting #) that were on the engine I bought



I sold the old longblock to @bri2203 for cheap just to get it off my hands, so I don't have my old heads. I think that engine became a coffee table lol.

Weren't the valves upgrades as well? I thought you said there was something different about them vs stock...but otherwise, that Elliot Motorsports package looks like a pretty good option.

Sorry, I no longer have the heads. I decided to stick the LS platform for my project.

[Gearhead4life]

depending on the head casing numbers, just have the machine shop put new guides in, the rest you can your self and save a couple hundred bucks. Are you planning on staying stock for valve size, seals, springs and rockers ?

[mcalus]

Get a set of stock heads, put it back together and enjoy it for the summer. If everything goes well, pull the heads in the winter and send them to lloyd.

[FASHOOTER]

Doesn't sound like u know the history of your current "ported heads" I doubt you will loose much power with stockers. LE a great option or AI heads, the LEs pop up once in awhile for sale used. Guess it depends how fast you want it together.

[alone_and_insane]

depending on the head casing numbers, just have the machine shop put new guides in, the rest you can your self and save a couple hundred bucks. Are you planning on staying stock for valve size, seals, springs and rockers ?

1.6rr's and stiffer valve springs. Stock valve size and seals, but the valves need to be ground. The big kicker though is that my heads need to be repaired from the damage that happened to them (like welding and machining). I didn't even know they needed a valve job until I took them to the machine shop to be repaired.

Get a set of stock heads, put it back together and enjoy it for the summer. If everything goes well, pull the heads in the winter and send them to lloyd.

Once this thing is back together and driving, the absolute last thing I'm gonna want to do is tear back into it. Not to mention I don't want to pay for a tune twice.

Doesn't sound like u know the history of your current "ported heads" I doubt you will loose much power with stockers. LE a great option or AI heads, the LEs pop up once in awhile for sale used. Guess it depends how fast you want it together.

I'm just not convinced that stock heads are gonna get me to my goals. I don't want to go through all this headache to come up short on what I really want to achieve with this car.

What do you think are the best places to try to find some used aftermarket heads? I tried Facebook groups and I've been perusing LS1tech, but haven't found anything so far.

[JoeliusZ28]

What about using trick flow 21 degree heads as cast from summit? I believe theyre less than $1000 from summit havent checked in a while. Also what are your cam specs? Hard to make recommendations without that.

[JoeliusZ28]

Also fwiw my car is putting 370 to the wheels with the following setup:

AI 226/234 cam, 374 casting heads shaved .020 with cleaned up/polished valve bowls. NO porting.

Edit: one more thing. I think youre going to find that just about any set of used heads wont pass inspection on valve guides. For some reason LT1s seem to kill intake valve guides yet its an issue that doesnt seem to present itself. When i tore my car down at 90k miles for my cam install the intake guides were shot and i would have never known... The engine ran flawlessly. And ive heard of other people having similar experiences.

[birdie2000]

The cam is a Lunati 60121 cam. 219/227 (or 221/229 depending on where you look for the specs) and mid .500's lift with 1.6rr.

A dude on LS1tech did a 383 with this cam and the as-cast Trick Flow heads and made like 410rwhp with a ridiculous torque curve through a t56. Could end up being a good combo on a 350.

[JoeliusZ28]

Wow if he hit those numbers with that small of a cam 383 or not id go with those heads for sure. Plus theres no hassle of a valve job or sending them out, they just show up on your door step

[birdie2000]

Here it is: 405rwhp/415rwtq

http://ls1tech.com/forums/lt1-lt4-mo...l#post13333429

Granted, 383... but still.