NEW 5th Gen Interior Leaks

[MP81]

rather, nothing there at all...

convertible?

[JoeliusZ28]

Here's a good report with video...and these cars are full roof cars...yes, yes, too many SUVs I know...but watch the Chevy Malibu roll over results...now imagine T-tops...or, rather, nothing there at all...

Enjoy...from autosafety.org...

http://nmmstream.net:8080/ramgen/cas/rollover.rm

my computer doesnt seem to know what an "rm" file is.

Either way, that video sounds like it has cars that dont have convertible versions.... in other words vehicles that only have ONE roof instead of 3. The point i was making was the difference between hardtop and t-top safety being minimal (across the same platform).

Theres a reason convertibles cost way more to insure, yet insurance companies dont even care if you have t-tops. On the fourth gen, a hardtop gave you some rigidity... that was about it.

The 4th gen had 5 star crash ratings in its day with both verts and t-tops. I have faith it will repeat history.

[GETGONE]

Here is a post by Scott Settlemire over on ChirpThird

We will be sharing more pics of uncammo'd cars shortly.

A word of caution -- (and it brings my point closer to home after the interior shots appeared over the past 24 hours.....) -- these cars are in no way finished. If I had to give a 'percentage' -- I'd say 65% complete. For instance -- when you see pics of the uncammo'd cars -- you'll note the headlamps look strange -- and that's because the production ones aren't ready -- the ones on these early mules are literally 'off the shelf from an autoparts store' headlamps -- literally glued/screwed into a pre-production grille........... Fits and finishes are lacking because they are pre-production parts. Interiors? Many switches and surfaces are plastic and in some cases, controls aren't actually what will be used in the final product.

The frustration? We WANT to share with you -- but we hope that the enthusiast community will not jump to conclusions -- and will await seeing the final product before drawing final conclusions.

Oh - and no, you won't see a production Camaro at NAIAS. You WILL see Bumblebee, however! (and he just may be wearing a brand new set of wheels.....)
__________________

here's the 'long response' I put out on some other sites......(some don't discourage bad behavior) -- so disregard my rants about bad behavior......


.............


I've always said that one of the best parts of owning a Camaro is the 'people' part........we are blessed to have so many people who feel so passionate about this great nameplate.

I've spent a lot of time on this (and many other) sites over the past dozen years because I felt that it was important to have the 'pulse' of the enthusiast. I also feel it's appropriate at times to give some hints (wink, wink) and answer questions.

Now -- all that said -- I can also tell you that --at times -- it's been a huge source of frustration as well.

We (that's you and me) need to remember that we (that's you and me) are not the 'end all' of what is and is not Camaro.

I have said in many meetings over the years that those of us within GM that work on Camaro/Firebird/Corvette are but the custodians of the brand.

We are not the brand.

We are the CUSTODIANS of the brand.

And I can tell you that it's something that every person who has worked on -- or is working on -- these brands understands that idea.........

I'd ask everyone on this site to keep the same thing in mind. Yes -- you may be an absolutely "dyed in the wool" enthusiast -- but please understand that while there are things you many not like -- we must keep ALL enthusiasts in mind as we design/engineer/build these wonderful cars.

You may not like, say, a seat fabric -- and that's fine -- but at the same time, 95% of our other enthusiasts may love it or find it acceptable...............in fact, it doesn't take you long on this site or any other site to realize that there is no way we -- or any other manufacturer -- will ever get 100% agreement on anything!

We must balance everything so that the enthusiast will love it -- but so will vast numbers of other people who may not be an enthusiast -- but take one look at a new Camaro and fall in love with it....and just HAVE to have one in their garage.......

Yes -- we'd love to give you a 900 horsepower Camaro that gets 35mpg and has 25 available exterior colors with 20 interior colors -- all for $19,995..........but that is about as realistic as me marrying Sandy Bullock or Daisy Fuentes or Christie Brinkley...........

The Camaro MUST be realistically priced so that most -- if not all -- of you can afford one.........

That's why I constantly ask people to keep a sense of 'decorum' as we (that's you and me) discuss the Camaro (and other cars...)

I'm sorry, but "That looks like *ss" is NOT appropriate for this site or any other (Jason/Chris - correct me if I'm wrong....) ....because, you see -- when you type something like that, you insult many people...and while you may not like it, 80 percent of other enthusiasts may think it's great and like it.

(and please -- to a certain person in the state of Illinois ...please don't post an unscientific survey because of this post.......)

Now....with that said -- I talked with John F. (Fbodfather 2.0) today after the interior pics leaked from the car carrier..........and we both believe it's important to talk about where these cars are in terms of production intent.

As you look at the uncammo'd cars (and yes, we will be posting some other pictures in the near future) -- and as you look at the unauthorized pictures of the interior........PLEASE KEEP THE FOLLOWING IN MIND:

1. None of these mules are anywhere near complete. Most parts are pre-production parts. If I had to assign a 'percentage' -- I'd say the cars are at 65% of production intent........

2. Some of the parts you see aren't even close to what you'll see on the production Camaro. For instance -- if you were to suddenly see a Camaro without the front bra in place -- you'd see some 'horrible' headlamps. There's a good reason for that...the production lamps are not ready - -and as a result - many of the mules have what I call....
" ..hey Joe - go run down to the local autoparts store and grab us a buncha headlamps and then go hot-glue 'em in place on those Camaro mules over there!!!!".........headlamps.............

..........see what I mean? So -- see something that doesn't look right? Hang in there -- it's likely to change!!!

3. Mules are usually painted white for a good reason -- I'll get into that one of these days -- but yes -- we know some of you don't want white -- but we aren't about to paint 'em every shade of the rainbow for testing.....patience, my friend -- patience!

4. Interior pictures are very misleading. As I said above, many of the parts are either pre-production -- 'off the shelf' parts to serve as placeholders -- or hard plastic and used only as a 'stand in.'
(Remember when I said a few weeks ago that the hips didn't disappear? Remember that a few of you didn't believe me? )

Keep something in mind today and tomorrow and next week and next month and next year.........................

........If one of us (John, Cheryl, myself, etc) say something -- we mean it. I plan to be on this and other sites for a long time to come. We don't intentionally lie. That's not our style.


Sooooooooo...............

let's keep the conversation going. Let's keep the faith..... (remember when I said that wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy back in August of 2001 when I said "the Camaro WILL be back??".......

Please -- I'm begging you -- please hold off in final judgement until you see the finished product. If there's something you see that you don't like -- it's OK to discuss -- but let's hold off with the insults -- and let's also respect each others' opinions.

Finally -- you can be ASSURED that the final production Camaro is the most researched and most 'Camaro enthusiast injected' (sorry - couldn't quickly think of how to put that....) Camaro ever.......

.......and when the smoke clears sometime in 2008 -- I think 99% of you are gonna love it. To the other 1% -- sorry -- we tried!

(and NO, the production Camaro will not be at NAIAS -- Bumblebee, however, WILL be there ....and just mebbe wearing a new set of wheels to replace the plastic wheelcovers......)

[81DaytonaPaceCar]

The 4th gen had 5 star crash ratings in its day with both verts and t-tops. I have faith it will repeat history.

Hahahahahaaaaa...oooh, you got me there...

The "mythical" 5-star crash test rating is solely verified, and I do mean solely verified, on 3, count 'em, 3 tests. These tests are performed first by the OEM (which will repeat the test until they get one they like), and then confirmed by the government and then the insurance industry (3 tests total to get you a 5-star rating).

The two main governing bodies are NHTSA (the government) and the IIHS (the insurance industry). Only NHTSA has a rollover test, although that is supposed to change for 2010, but I haven't seen the new spec yet.

A really good simple explaination can be found here:

http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/saf...4/article.html

A long read, but probably as short as it gets for government standards.

I can e-mail you the new 2010 specs in the morning if you'd like.

And it can easily be speculated that the 04 NHTSA rollover test killed the F-body.

Yep...a lack of safety compliance killed the F-body.

They never could or would comply to the new 2004 spec with that vehicle.

Funny story for ya...I was in the Guadalajara airport chatting with another US OEM engineer in the immigration line...we talked about what we were doing down there, and she asked me "What is the safest car in America?"

That one initially stumped me, and I had to think about it for a minute or two.

My answer:

A 1976 Cadillac Eldorado.

Huge.

Thick gauge steel.

Low to the ground.

Front wheel drive.

Underpowered for it's size.

Almost perfect.

Just make sure to get a big Eldo without the ultra rare driver airbag...those things were lethal...far more dangerous than the car...

[JoeliusZ28]

Yep...a lack of safety compliance killed the 4th gen.

fixed that for you.

i completely agree about the eldorado.

[GETGONE]

I thought it was well known that the demise of the 4th gen was because it wouldn't meet upcoming new safety regulations. It would have cost way to much to try and update the platform to meet the new regulations. That's why there was the hiatus(along with the whole St Therese debacle) and it's now an entirely new platform.

[JoeliusZ28]

Finally -- you can be ASSURED that the final production Camaro is the most researched and most 'Camaro enthusiast injected' (sorry - couldn't quickly think of how to put that....) Camaro ever.......

.......and when the smoke clears sometime in 2008 -- I think 99% of you are gonna love it. To the other 1% -- sorry -- we tried!

= T-tops

[nascarnate326]

So was it slow sales or saftey that killed the fbody?

Also, isnt the 4th gen just a updated 3rd gen?

[JoeliusZ28]

So was it slow sales or saftey that killed the fbody?

Also, isnt the 4th gen just a updated 3rd gen?

Sales dropped steady after 95, so yes. There was more than one reason the car went on "hiatus" though, another was the contract GM had with the st therese plant in canada.

and yes 4th gen is updated 3rd. Technically the 5th gen isnt an f-body, although it will be considered that.

[meissen]

I think the interior looks FREAKING sweet! For one, I really love that status bar that says "LESS THAN ___ LITERS FUEL" or something like that. That's awesome. It's techy, it's bells and whistles, I'll love it.

[JoeliusZ28]

I think the interior looks FREAKING sweet! For one, I really love that status bar that says "LESS THAN ___ LITERS FUEL" or something like that. That's awesome. It's techy, it's bells and whistles, I'll love it.

um are you kidding? thats just warning sticker for whoever is driving the mule that the car only has fuel capacity for 50 or so miles of driving.

[meissen]

...aw damnit. I thought that was real. I didn't look really close.

Ah well, I still think the interior is effin awesome. Totally different than the boring interiors of today. I can't wait to see the final product, it'll be even better.

[JoeliusZ28]

lol. I did not have a good impression of the interior at first but i think they will pull through yet. I thought the camo'd cars looked disgusting and the unmasked one exceeded my expectations. My only major gripes with this concept are the steering wheel and shifter, which are easily changed.

[MP81]

Yeah, the steering wheel isn't something easily retrofied with air-bags around.

[JoeliusZ28]

and for that reason i dont think they should even bother if they cant come close. all i really ask for is the center-section to be CENTERED. a circle inside of a circle, that isnt centered looks terrible.