Clutch System Woes - advice please!

[Atrus]

What I was basically saying is you don't need anything more than a stock replacement master and an LS7 clutch. Your going to gain absolutely nothing by going to an adjustable master on a car that makes 300hp and gets shifted at 6,000 RPM.

Cool, thanks. That's what I was really hoping to hear.

Now, if I could just get this damn clutch line off...

[birdie2000]

Out of curiosity, is there a pre-bled master/slave for the LS1 cars like there is for the LT1 cars? I just bought a stock master/slave that was pre-bled straight from GM. Was like $140 I think and it took all the guesswork out of it.

[Atrus]

Out of curiosity, is there a pre-bled master/slave for the LS1 cars like there is for the LT1 cars? I just bought a stock master/slave that was pre-bled straight from GM. Was like $140 I think and it took all the guesswork out of it.

That I don't know.

Here's what I do know...ended up getting the hydraulic line disconnected from the slave and guess what - pedal is rock solid. So, that tells me there's something wrong with the clutch and/or slave, correct?

Does anyone have the Delco/GM part number for the complete master kit (MC, reservoir, braided hydraulic line)? Dealer price is about $245. Online, all I am seeing is the clutch and line to the reservoir for $100ish. I'd have to buy the hydraulic line separately, unless I feel that the OE one is OK to reuse. I'm thinking at this point, I just want to replace EVERYTHING so I don't have to deal with it again for (hopefully) a LONG time.

Actually, here. This is a list of questions I have:

1) Does anyone have the Delco/GM part number for the complete master kit (MC, reservoir, braided hydraulic line)? The P/N I see online doesn't include the hydraulic line.
2) Can the flywheel and pressure plate bolts be reused?
3) I'd need to order the following, correct?
- LS7 Clutch Kit (Pressure plate, clutch disc, flywheel)
- LS1 Slave (if I order the Delco, this comes with the throwout bearing, right?)
- LS1 Pilot Bearing
- LS1 Master Cylinder
4) Is there anything I need to be concerned about as far as balancing goes if I am buying a complete LS7 kit?
5) When I remove the driveshaft to get the trans out, it will leak fluid out of the tailshaft, correct?
6) Is there anything else - anything at all - that I should know before I dive into this?

I am thinking before I order any parts, I am going to get the trans on the ground so I can thoroughly inspect it all. I'll read some of the "how to's" on dropping the trans for any little tips and tricks.

[Iroc'nthe87]

Actually, here. This is a list of questions I have:

1) Does anyone have the Delco/GM part number for the complete master kit (MC, reservoir, braided hydraulic line)? The P/N I see online doesn't include the hydraulic line.
2) Can the flywheel and pressure plate bolts be reused?
3) I'd need to order the following, correct?
- LS7 Clutch Kit (Pressure plate, clutch disc, flywheel)
- LS1 Slave (if I order the Delco, this comes with the throwout bearing, right?)
- LS1 Pilot Bearing
- LS1 Master Cylinder
4) Is there anything I need to be concerned about as far as balancing goes if I am buying a complete LS7 kit?
5) When I remove the driveshaft to get the trans out, it will leak fluid out of the tailshaft, correct?
6) Is there anything else - anything at all - that I should know before I dive into this?

Some answers:

1) 12570277
2) They can be re-used but cheap insurance to buy new.
3) That stuff looks right, the delco should have the TO bearing, might need to borrow an alignment tool.
4)The complete kit comes ready to install.

[Nocooler]

FYI - you don't need a GM master - they aren't anything special.

Just get a Autozoo or Advance replacement. Advance has an all cast piece that I used in my car for a few months and it was nice.

Reuse the stock line - but drill out the restrictor.

5) - drain the trans before attempting to remove it

EDIT

2) - they are supposed to be TTYL - I'd replace them.

[Atrus]

FYI - you don't need a GM master - they aren't anything special.

Just get a Autozoo or Advance replacement. Advance has an all cast piece that I used in my car for a few months and it was nice.

Reuse the stock line - but drill out the restrictor.

5) - drain the trans before attempting to remove it

Cool, thanks. What about Slave cylinders? Best to go with Delco, or are the local aftermarket alternatives OK? The reason I was looking at Delco is I know GM made a revision in the '01-'02 hydraulics to improve them. I am just hoping the aftermarket would have the same revisions.

Bummer on the trans fluid - I literally just replaced that 200 miles ago. Oh well, I guess my trans just got a flush!

Yeah, will just replace the fasteners. Cheap insurance, right?

Thanks again, guys. And, just to confirm before I start ripping stuff apart - being that the clutch pedal is really hard after disconnecting the slave, this indicates that it's not the CMC causing the problem, correct? (Meaning, I have other issues to dive into). I don't see anything dripping/seeping, no loss of fluid. I assume the slave can fail without rupturing? Almost seems like maybe the slave reached the end of it's travel - maybe something bent in there?


EDIT: Looks like Autozone has 20% off their ship-to-home, ending today. I can get a Duralast CMC, Duralast Slave, and alignment tool for $113 shipped. Would you guys go this route? If they don't have the "AP" branding on them, I could always return them.

[Iroc'nthe87]

EDIT

2) - they are supposed to be TTYL - I'd replace them.

Pretty sure they're sequenced torque, not TTY.

[Nocooler]

Pretty sure they're sequenced torque, not TTY.

They could be - but everything I've seen states to discard after one use.

Cool, thanks. What about Slave cylinders? Best to go with Delco, or are the local aftermarket alternatives OK? The reason I was looking at Delco is I know GM made a revision in the '01-'02 hydraulics to improve them. I am just hoping the aftermarket would have the same revisions.

Slave - I've just run the AP badged ones that Monster sells. They've held up fine.
Master - the biggest noticiable difference is getting rid of the restricion in the line.

Get a a speed bleeder from tick and you'll be able to bleed the system quick

[Atrus]

Absolutely will be doing a speed bleeder since I'll have it apart.

[Atrus]

Anyone ever use of the these remote bleeders? Looks to be very similar to the tick, but is $20 cheaper. Just want to make sure it's not going to cause me a bunch of problems - the Tick has great reviews. If the line breaks or leaks, I get to drop the trans again, which I don't want to do!

http://www.speedwaymotors.com/T56-Re...der,41385.html

Ordered the Duralast CMC, Slave, and alignment tool for $113 shipped. Not too shabby. Need to also get the clutch kit, trans fluid, pilot bearing, and flywheel/PP fasteners.


I did get the console and shifter out tonight, and got it up into the air. If it needs to be higher, I'll have to get my old man's tall jackstands. Went to use the ramp for the rear end, but the tires are too wide.

I'll yank the driveshaft and whatnot tomorrow - just gonna pick away at it the next few nights.

[Atrus]

So, an update:

Car is still on jack stands. I replaced:

CMC - Duralast
Slave - Duralast, with "AP" branding
Flywheel - GM LS7
Clutch/Pressure Plate - GM LS7

Nothing odd during reassembly except the trans stopped about 1/2" or so from the bellhousing. I think it was the dowel pins being tight on the bellhousing...used the trans bolts to pull it in. Didn't have to wrench on it real hard to get it seated.

Everything is back together. Bled a pint of fluid through the clutch and it feels good. Just started the car (again, on stands), and it was pretty difficult to get it into gear. In any gear, with the engine running/clutch in, the wheels are spinning. I can hit the brake and they stop and the car doesn't try to stall. Let off the brake and it starts spinning the wheels again.

Is this normal for a 0 mile clutch - meaning, no weight on it spinning tires? Does it just need to get some miles on it?

Thanks for answering all my questions, guys!

[hoogiesngrinderz]

So, an update:

Car is still on jack stands. I replaced:

CMC - Duralast
Slave - Duralast, with "AP" branding
Flywheel - GM LS7
Clutch/Pressure Plate - GM LS7

Nothing odd during reassembly except the trans stopped about 1/2" or so from the bellhousing. I think it was the dowel pins being tight on the bellhousing...used the trans bolts to pull it in. Didn't have to wrench on it real hard to get it seated.

Everything is back together. Bled a pint of fluid through the clutch and it feels good. Just started the car (again, on stands), and it was pretty difficult to get it into gear. In any gear, with the engine running/clutch in, the wheels are spinning. I can hit the brake and they stop and the car doesn't try to stall. Let off the brake and it starts spinning the wheels again.

Is this normal for a 0 mile clutch - meaning, no weight on it spinning tires? Does it just need to get some miles on it?

Thanks for answering all my questions, guys!

That is normal for the tires to spin in neutral or clutch in with a manual. Even with the clutch pressed, the disc is still getting some friction from the flywheel and causing the input shaft to spin. Some of that energy gets transferred through the bearing to the main/output shaft.

[1BADAIR]

Pulling the trans in is never good. Sometimes the pilot isn't lined up, some times opening the bleeder helps. Did you measure the throwout clearance?

[Atrus]

Pulling the trans in is never good. Sometimes the pilot isn't lined up, some times opening the bleeder helps. Did you measure the throwout clearance?

I didn't, as I read that the LS7 setup should never need one. I'm regretting that I didn't.

I'll bleed the system again tomorrow and see where that gets me. Any other things you guys can think of to check before I'd pull it apart again?

Hoogies - that's what I was thinking too, but being that it's kind of difficult to get into gear, I think there's still something off. Hopefully a clutch bleed takes care of it.

[Nocooler]

No the tires should not spin - that's a good indication that the clutch isn't disengaging.

Really I don't think a pint of fluid is enough to get the air out with the stock style master and new hydraulics.

Crack the speed bleeder and pump that thing until nothing but a solid stream of fluid comes out.

Buy a gallon of fluid and go to town

Did you drill the line?